gaining

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread4 weeks

van:
I wish my body could digest that much fat in one sitting lol


I guess thats I would only consume it Intermittently at the very least and not at once and I'm looking the viability of adding an emulsifier not just for the olive oil as becomingoverweight has recommended, like soy lecithin or the like to rather, help with mixing it all and being able to take it down.

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread4 weeks

Proxlterio:
Within a kind of head to head overfeeding study on the subject ,"Both groups gained similar weight. Saturated Fatty Acids, however, markedly increased liver fat compared with Poly Unsaturated Fatty Acids and caused a twofold larger increase in Visceral Adipose Tissue than PolyUnsaturated Fatty Acids. Conversely, PolyUnsaturated Fatty Acids caused a nearly threefold larger increase in lean tissue than SFAs." so take that for how you, I conclude that by the mere fact it the topic involves hormones, I find its far too complex to discuss within this forum as it encompasses many field of study


But that study has to do with palm oil, not dairy fat or stearic acid. I at no point said palm oil was healthy.

Proxlterio:
Yeah, and as you see, even within the context of the shake being consumed intermittently, it wouldn't be enjoyable.


That is likely true.

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread4 weeks

But that study has to do with palm oil, not dairy fat or stearic acid. I at no point said palm oil was healthy.


Alright I'll admit you got me, but personally still the reason I went with having the boost is that yes, carbs are more likely to add visceral fat, but this is in addition to the subcutaneous fat it still adds, and it's a really good insulin trigger, which makes it easy to take in the calories here. and the reason why I didn't make the heavy cream the base is that in large amounts it can be overwhelming (at least for me, 8oz is alot still, but that's more on my part, and I'm looking at replacing the coconut cream with unrefined shea butter as tbsp for tbsp it's double the calories and has the benefits you put in your page).

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread4 weeks

Proxlterio:
Alright I'll admit you got me, but personally still the reason I went with having the boost is that yes, carbs are more likely to add visceral fat, but this is in addition to the subcutaneous fat it still adds, and it's a really good insulin trigger, which makes it easy to take in the calories here. and the reason why I didn't make the heavy cream the base is that in large amounts it can be overwhelming (at least for me, 8oz is alot still, but that's more on my part, and hey thanks for the recommendation of the shea butter I'll replace the coconut because the shea is more available in the calorically dense form here.


Insulin isn't actually required to store dietary fat. Dietary fat alone can induce fat storage.
Effects of an oral and intravenous fat load on adipose tissue and forearm lipid metabolism

Carbohydrates also aren't converted into body fat as efficiently as fat is. Also, the higher percentage of the fat becoming visceral fat means less of the fat will be subcutaneous fat. If one didn't mind visceral fat this wouldn't be an issue though so I guess it depends on people's preferences.

Heavy cream is indeed pretty thick so it is hard to drink a lot at once.

You're welcome regarding the shea butter suggestion. Just make sure you get the food-grade latex-free kind. I got some with latex and it tasted/smelled bad.

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread4 weeks

becomingoverweight:
Insulin isn't actually required to store dietary fat. Dietary fat alone can induce fat storage.
Effects of an oral and intravenous fat load on adipose tissue and forearm lipid metabolism

Carbohydrates also aren't converted into body fat as efficiently as fat is. Also, the higher percentage of the fat becoming visceral fat means less of the fat will be subcutaneous fat. If one didn't mind visceral fat this wouldn't be an issue though so I guess it depends on people's preferences.

Heavy cream is indeed pretty thick so it is hard to drink a lot at once.

You're welcome regarding the shea butter suggestion. Just make sure you get the food-grade latex-free kind. I got some with latex and it tasted/smelled bad.


Yeah, but I still put the carbs here because it kind of creates a cycle of high consumption, and high appetite, high fat storage, because of what it does to insulin and leptin. It does more to help other aspects of gaining which makes it easier, it's not just raw gains but everything else around it to aide gaining, alongside the fats, because fats are filling even in relatively small amounts, so the carbs I feel are beneficial to the whole thing.

I'm thinking of combining the Shea butter with the coconut oil ( I made a mistake on the first post) into a cream, and would it be better to just use unrefined shea butter and make the cream myself?

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread3 weeks

Proxlterio:
Yeah, but I still put the carbs here because it kind of creates a cycle of high consumption, and high appetite, high fat storage, because of what it does to insulin and leptin. It does more to help other aspects of gaining which makes it easier, it's not just raw gains but everything else around it to aide gaining, alongside the fats, because fats are filling even in relatively small amounts, so the carbs I feel are beneficial to the whole thing.

I'm thinking of combining the Shea butter with the coconut oil ( I made a mistake on the first post) into a cream, and would it be better to just use unrefined shea butter and make the cream myself?


I decided to look up some science regarding the effects of dietary carbs and fat on leptin levels. What I found was surprising. Apparently carbs, calorie per calorie, raise leptin levels more than fat. As such, carbs are apparently more filling than fat. I was surprised by this as I always hear fat's more filling than carbs. I suppose that's true mass-wise but apparently not calorie-wise. I suppose the higher levels of leptin after eating carbs could help contribute to the gainer or feedee's leptin resistance but that's assuming the post-prandial increase in leptin levels makes a significant contribution to leptin resistance. Then again, that also makes the assumption that the choices of food have the same calories. Fat's more calorie dense than carbs mass-wise so if their choices of food had to have the same mass, then the fattier food would be the best for weight gain and raising leptin levels.

You can combine the Shea butter and coconut oil together to make a cream. Do they already sell it in an edible cream-form where you live though? Interesting. If they don't, you should be able to make said cream yourself. I need to look more into the effects of overfeeding coconut oil but I'll post this now as I already spent so much time looking at scientific studies.

Leptin response to carbohydrate or fat meal and association with subsequent satiety and energy intake.

Postprandial leptin response to carbohydrate and fat meals in obese women.

Differing effects of high-fat or high-carbohydrate meals on food hedonics in overweight and obese individuals.

The effects of high-carbohydrate vs high-fat breakfasts on feelings of fullness and alertness, and subsequent food intake.

Carbohydrates, fats, and satiety.

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread3 weeks

becomingoverweight:
I decided to look up some science regarding the effects of dietary carbs and fat on leptin levels. What I found was surprising. Apparently carbs, calorie per calorie, raise leptin levels more than fat. As such, carbs are apparently more filling than fat. I was surprised by this as I always hear fat's more filling than carbs. I suppose that's true mass-wise but apparently not calorie-wise. I suppose the higher levels of leptin after eating carbs could help contribute to the gainer or feedee's leptin resistance but that's assuming the post-prandial increase in leptin levels makes a significant contribution to leptin resistance. Then again, that also makes the assumption that the choices of food have the same calories. Fat's more calorie dense than carbs mass-wise so if their choices of food had to have the same mass, then the fattier food would be the best for weight gain and raising leptin levels.

You can combine the Shea butter and coconut oil together to make a cream. Do they already sell it in an edible cream-form where you live though? Interesting. If they don't, you should be able to make said cream yourself. I need to look more into the effects of overfeeding coconut oil but I'll post this now as I already spent so much time looking at scientific studies.


Oh, I know that carbs increase leptin, and in normal circumstances, it regulates appetite and signals satiety to the brain, but were not in the land of normal, far from normal, in fact we're nearly 1300 grams over the daily recommendation normal (and counting but as of the time of writing this what it is) and that's where the high consumption parts comes. While yes carbs are smaller that fats and proteins in terms of calories, the thing is it's really easy to consume lots of it and not even know it because so many foods contain so much of it (for example 1 12oz can of coca cola has 39 grams of carbs, and the big mac, the metaphysical manifestation of the ever illusive obesity epidemic, that has 37 grams of carbohydrates and let me tell you, they are not that filling and so is most of Mcdonalds food and I theorize that's to make you eat more of it) and so many people eat more carbs than they think and you know about sugar cravings? those exist partly because of the chemicals in the brain that carbs set off (like seratonin[1], and dopamine[2]) so I'd argue that's why the discussion of the calories per gram aspect should take into account how much people will likely take in, and high carbs are more likely to spike blood sugar, for glucose is released from the carbs, and is then absorbed into the blood, with high blood sugar levels stimulating a release of insulin, which stimulates the liver to synthesize glucose as glycogen, and as glycogen levels increase, further synthesis is suppressed,and any additional glucose taken up by hepatocytes is shunted into pathways leading to synthesis of fatty acids, which are exported from the liver as lipoproteins, which get ripped apart during the path, providing free fatty acids for use in other tissues, like adipocytes, which use them to synthesize triglyceride, with insulin also inhibiting breakdown of said fatty acids in adipose tissue by inhibiting the intracellular lipase, and facilitates entry of glucose into adipocytes, and within those cells, can be used to synthesize glycerol, of which along with the fatty acids delivered from the liver, are used to synthesize triglyceride within the adipocyte, and thus, by these mechanisms, insulin is involved in further accumulation of triglyceride in fat cells.(Bowen 2019)[3] As Sandi Busch for Livestrong puts it "insulin prevents you from losing weight while also making you more prone to gaining weight."[4]

And in terms of leptin, yes it makes leptin higher and in high amounts can induce leptin resistance, which is the key so as to keep on the appetite by effect, putting the brain in a state that's the closest thing to a "starvation mode", and making it easier to create a energy surplus of which means more of the energy taken in will be converted to fat (Gunnars 2018)[5] So let just say, more filling, but for only so long.

Not that I'm aware of (not that I'm particularly concerned with locality because I'm shopping online) but personally, I would rather make it myself so as to have control and 1 thing for sure is that there isn't anything like I described on thee first page so that's that

WORKS CITED

[1] Wurtman, R J, and J J Wurtman. �Brain Serotonin, Carbohydrate-Craving, Obesity and Depression.� Obesity Research, U.S. National Library of Medicine, 3 Nov. 1995,

[2]Kenny, Paul J. �Reward Mechanisms in Obesity: New Insights and Future Directions.� Neuron, U.S. National Library of Medicine, 24 Feb. 2011
Continued in next post

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread3 weeks

WORKS CITED PT 2

[3]Bowen, Richard A. �Physiologic Effects of Insulin.� Physiologic Effects of Insulin, Colorado State University, Feb. 2019,

[4]Busch, Sandi. �Why Do Carbohydrates Make You Gain Weight?� LIVESTRONG.COM, Leaf Group,

[5]Gunnars, Kris. �Leptin and Leptin Resistance: Everything You Need to Know.� Healthline, Healthline Media, 4 Dec. 2018

I cant believe I ran out of space on what was my manifesto lol

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread3 weeks

Proxlterio:
Oh, I know that carbs increase leptin, and in normal circumstances, it regulates appetite and signals satiety to the brain, but were not in the land of normal, far from normal, in fact we're nearly 1300 grams over the daily recommendation normal (and counting but as of the time of writing this what it is) and that's where the high consumption parts comes. While yes carbs are smaller that fats and proteins in terms of calories, the thing is it's really easy to consume lots of it and not even know it because so many foods contain so much of it (for example 1 12oz can of coca cola has 39 grams of carbs, and the big mac, the metaphysical manifestation of the ever illusive obesity epidemic, that has 37 grams of carbohydrates and let me tell you, they are not that filling and so is most of Mcdonalds food and I theorize that's to make you eat more of it) and so many people eat more carbs than they think and you know about sugar cravings? those exist partly because of the chemicals in the brain that carbs set off (like seratonin[1], and dopamine[2]) so I'd argue that's why the discussion of the calories per gram aspect should take into account how much people will likely take in, and high carbs are more likely to spike blood sugar, for glucose is released from the carbs, and is then absorbed into the blood, with high blood sugar levels stimulating a release of insulin, which stimulates the liver to synthesize glucose as glycogen, and as glycogen levels increase, further synthesis is suppressed,and any additional glucose taken up by hepatocytes is shunted into pathways leading to synthesis of fatty acids, which are exported from the liver as lipoproteins, which get ripped apart during the path, providing free fatty acids for use in other tissues, like adipocytes, which use them to synthesize triglyceride, with insulin also inhibiting breakdown of said fatty acids in adipose tissue by inhibiting the intracellular lipase, and facilitates entry of glucose into adipocytes, and within those cells, can be used to synthesize glycerol, of which along with the fatty acids delivered from the liver, are used to synthesize triglyceride within the adipocyte, and thus, by these mechanisms, insulin is involved in further accumulation of triglyceride in fat cells.(Bowen 2019)[3] As Sandi Busch for Livestrong puts it "insulin prevents you from losing weight while also making you more prone to gaining weight."[4]

And in terms of leptin, yes it makes leptin higher and in high amounts can induce leptin resistance, which is the key so as to keep on the appetite by effect, putting the brain in a state that's the closest thing to a "starvation mode", and making it easier to create a energy surplus of which means more of the energy taken in will be converted to fat (Gunnars 2018)[5] So let just say, more filling, but for only so long.

Not that I'm aware of (not that I'm particularly concerned with locality because I'm shopping online) but personally, I would rather make it myself so as to have control and 1 thing for sure is that there isn't anything like I described on thee first page so that's that

WORKS CITED

[1] Wurtman, R J, and J J Wurtman. �Brain Serotonin, Carbohydrate-Craving, Obesity and Depression.� Obesity Research, U.S. National Library of Medicine, 3 Nov. 1995,

[2]Kenny, Paul J. �Reward Mechanisms in Obesity: New Insights and Future Directions.� Neuron, U.S. National Library of Medicine, 24 Feb. 2011
Continued in next post


Those are good points. I completely neglected the craving aspect of carbs. Also I know how you feel regarding exceeding the character limit.

hypothetical dream gainer shake/critique thread1 week

Okay, So I'm trying to max out this shake to 50k+ calories, does anybody know of anything calorically dense (food supplement, etc...), I could put in that's not on the list already?
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