General

Here's this story from The Telegraph:

tinyurl.com/35rvttf

Here's the most important sentence: "As many as 75% of men and 68% of women believed that overweight passengers should pay double."

I really feel like we're not doing a very good job of explaining the issues here. Even on this site there are a whole lot of people who think fat is simply a choice. And that puts fat people at real risk of this kind of hatred...

What should we be doing?

Eeek! I'd never fit into one of those seats *especially if they're anything like the lecture hall seats at my Uni*. Good thing I don't fly much lol

Well, chubbyhoney, part of the issue, they say, is that skinnies don't like the spillage coming into contact with them. See below, though--I'm not convinced.

Here's the seat issue, as I see it, in a few nutshells.

1. Seats are not a fixed size. As we all know the vary from airline to airline, and for those of us who have been flying for decades, they've gotten smaller and smaller and smaller, while people have simultaneously been getting bigger.

2. Airlines didn't always use the same business model as they do now. When I was younger, people didn't fly *nearly* as often as we do now. Seats were bigger, and more expensive, and none of this was an issue. Also, if I remember correctly, most European airlines were nationalised, or at least semi-nationalised. Not subsidised, I don't think, although I honestly don't know. Nonetheless, there were no discount airlines, and flying was mostly done by business people and the wealthy.

3. Finally, I think we have to wonder what's being sold when a person buys a ticket. We generally, until very, very recently, have assumed that what we were buying is one person's travel, not 25 inches of seat space. Why should fat people pay more for travel? We are still each one person, and not less of one because there's more of us. Very buff passengers, who weigh more, are not being asked to pay more, yet they accrue the same fuel costs, so it can't be that. I've sat next to people who didn't mind my hips touching them, and others who were so skinny that we didn't even touch, so it can't be that either.

Once you really look at it, it's the intersection of, on the one hand, fat hatred run amok among the public, and on the other hand the grotesque profiteering of airlines. If they had kept their original business models, they wouldn't be in this predicament. And we'd be using a lot less fuel, contributing less to global warning, etc.

That's a great point, dude. I think people are really voting against their own interests. What they think is something like this: 'Well, sure, I've got a bit of a spare tire, but those huge people are disgusting. That obviously has nothing to do with me.' Well, let them wait another five years, and as they expand and the seats shrink, it won't be so easy!

On another note, if I'm the man next to you on the flight I want the armrest down, and on a cold day like tonight here in NY that fat spillage could help keep my skinny arm warm.

I don't think we ever owe corporations protections of their profits. They have most of the laws in their favours--vide the US Supreme Court decision to consider them person, who can thus donate unlimited unreported amounts to political campaigns--and they have untold abilities to protect themselves. We, on the other hand, are far less protected.

I don't think it's unreasonable to suggest that when airlines are making seats smaller and smaller, and people are getting fatter and fatter, there's something wrong.

And when that's compounded by policies that say they can decide when someone is too fat and needs two seats, and they can do so without warning, on the spot, with no recourse on the part of the traveler, then it's simply extortion. That's *quite* a different thing than Shazzy deciding on her own to be more comfortable.

And what about the professional implications? Does that make it ok for companies not to hire fat people, since it's more expensive for us to travel? This is NOT a small issue.

Brava! I couldn't have said it better myself.

Thanks, Winterstocking and lilwitchygirl.

@Winterstocking--while I still think it's wrong, I probably would pay for the larger seat. It matters to me to be comfortable. But when I was younger, I probably wouldn't have, though it depends on how much. I might always have paid $50 more.

@lilwitchygirl--I wonder if the same is true of other airlines? It might be worth calling and asking each time we fly, I guess...

The first time this issue came up, I was working for an orchestra, and some fat women came and said they wanted seating that fit them. Me and the other fat woman in the office giggled embarrassedly, but the thin marketing person said 'Why should they be uncomfortable? They paid the same as everyone else.' Quite a lesson.

I often think those of us who are fat have been less inclined to see the justice we deserve. We're too used to apologising.

Certainly