Some observations.

1. I don't know if the map function is the same for everyone or whether my computer isn't compatible with it, but in London I'm sure the flags are randomly placed. They're all in places where it's expensive to live or are central shopping or business areas. The areas where I know the vast majority of the population lives (areas of dense housing in eg. zone 2) have no-one marked.

2. I fixed on one person and every time I re-loaded the map she moved to a different place (in roughly the same 1-mile area, but in London that's a million people). So don't assume we all live on the same street just because of the flags!

3. Although there are a lot of us from FF who live in the London area, that IS because there are 8.3 million people in London (or 15 million if you look at the metropolitan area). It doesn't mean we can all drop in to the same coffee bar though. It would take 1-2 hours to get from say where Softgirl lives to say where Debz lives, or from where I live to say where JulesTeak lives*. London is huge. So if you live in the US and are 80 miles from someone and have use of a car, it's probably the same journey time (ish). If only you all didn't drive so slowly, anyway

*that's not to say I've made that journey lol, before tongues start wagging haha

4. As Salt says, it's generally the same few people at all the meet ups. We ARE lucky to have them & each other but in all fairness the fact they happen at all is down to a hard core of people who work REALLY hard to organise get-togethers and to galvanise others into enthusiasm.

For anyone buying suits, I can report the TM Lewin size 20 is a fairly small one, would probably be equivalent to a Next size 18.

We should have this thread as a sticky??

If your doctor makes a negative comment, you could try showing him/her this:

ideas.time.com/2013/06/24/if-obesity-is-a-disease-why-are-so-many-obese-people-healthy/

(With thanks to whoever posted it on a different thread)

Like, really??

Nice spot.

Something on Radio 4 today reminded me how great All About Eve (1950) is.

*blush* thanks!



I fear you're right.



Drago, that's my whole problem with her (and your) argument, in my humble opinion. I'm really glad you and she are able to take the responsibility for turning their comments around, not get upset, and maybe even make them see the error of their ways. But it's the fact that WE feel the burden falls on us to defend ourselves, explain/excuse our fatness, assert that we like being fat and/or that it's not their business to judge. Why do we feel it falls on US to make them see differently? That's at the root of the problem in my view. They shouldn't be feeling entitled to make that remark in the first place. The only reason they do is because as Juicy said, fat is the last acceptable prejudice.

"Prejudice" refers to a positive or negative evaluation of another person based on their group membership. Prejudice can also refer to unfounded beliefs (in this case, that fat is "bad" ) and may include any unreasonable attitude that is unusually resistant to rational influence (usually in this case that fat is "unhealthy" or "costs the taxpayer" ).

As littlepiggy1975 said:



Drago you're probably right, if we don't each start inviting people on an individual basis to see the error of their ways we'll never get anywhere.

But I still hate that a common first reaction is to put the onus on ourselves to deal with it rather than shifting the onus onto them to behave with respect for others.

Apologies for resurrecting a zombie thread, but I had such a dispiriting conversation tonight with a bright, sparky girl with whom I work, that I felt it might be useful for me to get some views on this issue, as I wonder if I'm being over-dramatic.

We were talking about how society judges women on their appearance. She couldn't see my point that it's unacceptable for someone to shout "fatty" at you in the street. Or rather, she could, but she wasn't prepared to put it on a par with someone shouting a racist comment or an anti-religion/disability comment. She thought, basically, that I should just get over it because they were obviously an idiot.

Her feeling was that there is freedom of speech and therefore because people will have different preferences they are entitled to say what they want. It may not be polite or make them anything other than a total tool, but the issue is more, she felt, about making women more empowered so that they're not depressed by someone making such a vile comment about them.

My issue with that is that whilst assisting women not to care what a person in a white van shouts out of his window about them is a good thing, we haven't made much progress on that front - most women are still paranoid about their appearance and most women in the public eye are chosen on the basis of/popular because of their looks.

My other issue with taking the stance that one has to just ignore it and assist women to have enough self esteem to stop it affecting them is this: it moves the problem from the person making the vile comment to the person on the receiving end. It makes it my problem to deal with being called a fatty or ugly. Which is obviously ridiculous. I'm not here to please others with the way I look. The problem lies with the person shouting that at me, and the general societal acceptance that it's okay to judge a woman on her appearance, and what's more it's perfectly fine to let her know about that judgment even if she hasn't asked. It's that sense of entitlement that if someone doesn't like the way I look, they're justified in pointing it out, even if I haven't asked their opinion.

The woman to whom I was speaking also mentioned something that made me even further depressed - she felt that someone shouting "fatty" at me wasn't the same as having a racist taunt shouted at me because "you can change being fat".

Anyway. My point is that I agree with Juicy that fat seems to be one of the last acceptable prejudices, but it's allied to the general view of most of society that it's fine to judge a person (most often a woman) on their appearance. It's not just being fat that appears to entitle people to feel they can discriminate against someone, but also if they're considered ugly. I'm sure it happens to men too, to a certain extent, but my feeling (but please tell me if you think I'm wrong) is that it's much more extreme/pervasive for women than men.

Should we just put up with people's comments and views and rise above it (they're obviously douches anyway) or should we expect more - should it be just as unacceptable to comment adversely on someone's appearance as it is to comment adversely on their race/religion/sexuality?

Is making fat/ugly-bashing a "hate crime" the solution or does that just stop people saying what they're really thinking?

Will making it not okay to criticise the way someone looks eventually help it filter through that it's not their right to judge anyone on the way they look, or is it pointless because people will always judge, they just won't be allowed to say it?

This is interesting (from another thread on here) - anyone know if this idea got any further?

telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/9297496/Calling-someone-fatty-could-become-a-hate-crime.html

I don't know why it took me so long to get round to buying some of the Lanacane anti-chafing gel but eventually I did this week.

I think it was because of the heatwave - wearing the extra layer of leggings or tights was just unbearable.

I am thrilled to report the Lanacane did the job! I went out tonight with bare legs in a dress and survived! Even the 15-minute walk to get home (after the gel had been on for 8 hours without a reapplication) was completely comfortable.

It's so weird, I haven't been out with bare legs and a dress/skirt for about 20 years!! I think I tried it once about 10 years ago to see if it was still impossible and was in agony after about half an hour, and never bothered again. I feel like I've been granted a whole other wardrobe option now!

It did obviously involve a good half hour of leg buffing/smoothing/de-fuzzing/moisturising/fake tanning beforehand though...

BTW all Boots stores seem to have sold out of Lanacane anti-chafing gel (although they still have the Lanacane powder and cream, but those seemed to be for slightly different problems). Obviously all the other fatties got there first and snapped it all up at the start of the heatwave. I got the gel online from Amazon.

I don't know why it took me so long to get round to buying some of the Lanacane anti-chafing gel but eventually I did this week.

I think it was because of the heatwave - wearing the extra layer of leggings or tights was just unbearable.

I am thrilled to report the Lanacane did the job! I went out tonight with bare legs in a dress and survived! Even the 15-minute walk to get home (after the gel had been on for 8 hours without a reapplication) was completely comfortable.

It's so weird, I haven't been out with bare legs and a dress/skirt for about 20 years!! I think I tried it once about 10 years ago to see if it was still impossible and was in agony after about half an hour, and never bothered again. I feel like I've been granted a whole other wardrobe option now!

It did obviously involve a good half hour of leg buffing/smoothing/de-fuzzing/moisturising/fake tanning beforehand though...

BTW all Boots stores seem to have sold out of Lanacane anti-chafing gel (although they still have the Lanacane powder and cream, but those seemed to be for slightly different problems). Obviously all the other fatties got there first and snapped it all up at the start of the heatwave. I got the gel online from Amazon.